July 10, 2021 A member Meeting, NOT a Board Meeting
This is a Member Meeting.
The members make the motions. The members vote. No Board business can be conducted. The members approve the minutes from last years (2020) meeting. The members approve or make motions for a change in this years agenda. "Special rules" are made by the members, not the Board.
Members can and should make a motion that "Member Motions" be placed at the start of the meeting. Floor comments is no. 18 on the agenda. This is by design. Previously it had been at the start of the meeting, but was changed to floor comments at the end of the meeting. Seems the members got all fired up and expressed anger and concerns. And we saw that being cut off before all members who wanted to speak, were allowed to do so.
Remember, it is a Member Meeting. Members should be allowed to speak on every agenda item at the time it is presented. The lighting covenant change member hearing is Board Business, not Annual meeting agenda unless the members present make the motion to discuss it. I think it would be good to discuss it and a member should make that motion. It is called following the rules and procedure. Members have the right to change the agenda. They can add or delete agenda items. It is your meeting.
The members, at this meeting, also have the right to make a motion to remove, without cause, any and all members of the sitting Board. A simple vote of those present and by proxy, can do this with a simple majority yes vote. An opinion by the association attorney is just that, an opinion. He has proven himself wrong in the past.
I would not approve the agenda without first knowing what the "special rules" are. There needs to be an explanation of item #8 Motions? Board nominations?
55 comments:
Thank you George. #6 has caught attention of those I speak with. We must find out what special rules are before adopting the agenda as well as move up 17 and 18 on the agenda prior to adopting.
Steve Cox, this is your time to speak up, you have your support there and let's get a few things changed.
So according to the Agenda, if you vote for more than 3 on your Proxy ballot it will be thrown out! Better get that changed first thing!
Too late now Doug, that little piece of paper went out with the new ballot! No corrected instructions! Thank goodness the board voted to accept ballots with only 3 votes!
I'll be attending the meeting but am not sure why you expect me to take charge of some unnamed motion or issue. If the opportunity is there, I will probably make some statement about the letter and effort we made to have a community vote BY MAIL to require a member vote of approval/ disapproval on any Board attempts to change the covenants.
I decided not to pursue this as a motion at the Annual Meeting. There are 3 primary reasons for that. 1) The number of members attending, and most I'd say, are opposed to motions or change 2) We are not willing to move forward with the re-wording of our re-write by the HOA attorney 3) The Board violated our Bylaws by voting to prevent our legal motion, and may try to scuttle this effort, as they have other motions.
We also see this as a no-brainer sure to be passed by reasonable thoughtful members, as it simply brings our HOA abreast of most HOAs, which require a member vote on covenant changes. As we enter this police-state period in Surfside, members need to declare their rightful authority to defend their property rights in the face of oncoming BOT intrusion, lighting restrictions and "Neat n' tidy" rules. We don't want to fail because of a lack of patience.
Is Gil going to give a water department report or will some clown from the water planning committee talk something they know nothing about? It's our biggest expense. Gil's report would be short. "I only do what I am told". That's a real comfort. Who is telling him, and how has that worked?
How about the fire wise BS? I was told the chipper contractor won't do it next year. We going to start up the crap again about buying our own chipper and how to operate it.
Will there be an office report by the Business manager to explain failed computer programs? How about a report on compliance violations and enforcement? Think they want to talk about that. Anyone want to bet any money on the Sheriff showing up?
Maybe we have to take care of all this during the comment session before Gary Williams cuts it off. Don't vote for GARY, SCOTT or TONY
Is it possible for a member to video tape this meeting since it is the members meeting? I truly believe our own record of this will be very useful if there is an attempt of some shady dealings during the meeting.
Yes! You can record it by audio or video. The association records it. You can also take pictures. We are in the electronic age. A not so simple cell phone can record. You may want to record member motions and comments. These can all be used as documents in court. Rather than a continuous video recording, I would suggest just doing portions that are important and skip all the propaganda BS they will present. Caution, this may be where they will try their "special rules". No recording. At the least, take notes. Notes are also documents in court.
Good news folks. The Washington state legislature passed SSB 5034. The bill is over 200 pages long and changes almost every aspect of nonprofit corporations in Washington state. Surfside’s articles of incorporation clearly declare that Surfside was formed as a Washington state nonprofit corporation. I have not read all of the bill. What I have read makes it clear the legislature was modernizing a very old law. The one part of the bill that jumped off the page was the expanded authority of the Washington state Attorney General to investigate and intervene with the management of nonprofit corporations to protect corporation assets. It sounds as if you may actually get your HOA police after all. The law will go into effect July 1 2022. I would think that would be plenty of time to consult with attorneys on the impact of this bill on Surfside. The Surfside business manager is no doubt on top of this development and has discussed this legislation with the board. You will probably see a lot of Sam during the next year.
We are in an EXTREME fire danger situation. Why are some damned fools building fires of any type on this peninsula? One spark threatens all of us. Same goes for the idiots who are setting off fireworks. Smarten up people. Take good care of yourself and those around you.
Fires are allowed on the beach as are fireworks. Move if you don't like. Isn't that what you say to those who don't like the covenants?? Funny!
We wouldn't have such fire danger if we all didn't have to cut our trees, now dying or had dead branches laying around. Thank you Peggy Olds!
Perhaps we need to rethink where our chipper is located! This is extremely dangerous and in a residential neighborhood. One asshole walking through there with their cigarette that's pissed off at Peggy and poof!
Allowed does not mean safe.
8:51 attitude doesn't create truth. telling people to move because there is an extreme fire danger now is simply nuts. fed up with the screwy rants on this blog. hope people will take great care with fire and fireworks during this critical time and always. fires for entertainment has always seemed silly to me.
From the Chinook Observer-21 hours ago....
Ban will be in effect today until further notice
OLYMPIA — Effective immediately, Washington State Parks is banning wood and charcoal fires at its parks statewide and on ocean beaches in the Seashore Conservation Area beginning at 5 p.m. Friday, July 2.
But fireworks are allowed. Go figure.....This world is nuts
The chipper site needs to be closed and cleared immediately. Can you imagine what will happen should a firework land in that area. If my house was anywhere near that lot I would be calling the fire district and demanding action.
@10:52, it needs to permanently be relocated! How about we locate it next to Peggy's house
It has been pointed out that the current site is so deep in chips, that it is not stable enough to build on. It is a prime site and location, made unmarketable.
In very hot conditions, piles of chips can spontaneously begin to burn from the interior of the pile. Farmers have to have systems that circulate grains stored in silos to prevent fires.
Methane develops as the grains ferment in silos, stirring helps slow this. The chipping of course is intended to help facilitate continuance of the mandatory Tree cutting.
8:51am Fires are now banned on the beach, updated today.
That's ok. We can burn a camp fire on our lot. Throw a few green pine branches on and it will keep the bugs and skeeters away. Burn baby burn.
FYI: Mr know-it-all, pied piper
The property of the chipper site is an abandoned well site and cannot be sold unless the well is decommissioned. According to our water folks that is a huge expensive undertaking. We currently have sprinklers on the pile with automatic timers to keep everything wet. The pile will be mulched for the first time next week to minimize the hazard.
I bet all the people who live near the chipper site are really looking forward to the mulcher running for hours. It will be music to their ears.
A mulched pile is more apt to spontaneous combust than a loose pile.
@4:50, okay Mr deleet, we should be the example then if in fact it is an abandoned well and fix it right. Deferred maintenance on our own property!! It blows me away how much Surfside covers up and all the illegal stuff they pull.
The sprinkler was laying on the ground earlier today, (it's a tall tri-pod)so how does this timer work?
You people waste our money, shfh!
450 - thanks very much for pointing out yet another issue that our board has not dealt with. Why do we elect these people? There is no one that is on that board currently that is worthy of re-election.
Close the chipper site and haul all the combustible debris away now. The people who live anywhere near this dump site have suffered long enough. It's dangerous and noisy and should have never been there in the first place. Some are concerned about yard art yer we've got a dump site amongst member's homes?
So the chipper site lot can't be sold due to the expense of decommissioning the well. No problem. How about we cancel the sheriff contract and use some of that money to build dual purpose pickle ball/basketball courts? That actually would enhance our community.
Cancel the proactive compliance and the compliance policeman and redirect $$ to add a covered gazebo with a couple of picnic tables.
You are really pitiful. I don't think it makes sense to try to legitimize the mandatory tree topping by offering a community chipping service for 2 or 3 months/year.
But I didn't make any accusations or blame anyone of anything in particular. My point is, we did this for a while and there were advantages and disadvantages. But does it make sense to make a huge commitment to doing this longterm.
Somehow 4:50, you find it offensive for any Surfside member to question Board decisions, or suggest there may be better solutions.
I just stated some facts to consider as potential concerns. Maybe if you ditched the "pied piper" attitude you might be able to pull your head out of that dark place and get a fresh outlook.
End the stupid tree cutting, end a huge amount of conflict, end the wasted thousands of dollars, end the endless cycle of violation notices and legal expenses incurred, end the noise and fire danger....take the crap to the County dumpsite.
We don't have a County dump site. In our peninsula area we have a private waste disposal site. It's called Peninsula sanitation. The surfside chipping site is an illegal site in violation of county ordinances. A county approved site is required to have a permit and be SCREENED, not just fenced. The screen is to prevent a view of it's ugly presence. I am sure that Fire Chief Brundage would think that one rain bird sprinkler for that large pile, mulched or not, is ridiculous. Located by the water, which is a violation, and by a popular beach path, is also rediculous.
It is against the law for an HOA to spend member funds for the care of others private property. We can only spend members funds on the care of association common properties. Why should I have to pay in my assessments and dues, for you to top and dispose of trees on your property? This is just another issue that the State needs to investigate. OSHA needs to investigate this safety and health violation.
In regards to the abandoned well on the chipper site...
Well information & resources. The Washington state well report (log) viewer allows you to search for and view detailed records of the construction and subsurface characteristics of individual wells. Well reports also contain information about location, owner name, driller name, and the quantity of water a well produces ...
We estimate there are thousands of abandoned wells in Washington. If you find an abandoned well on your property, you ARE REQUIRED to work with a licensed well driller to properly close it up, a process called "decommissioning."
Abandoned wells can be hazardous to people, animals, and the water supply. Landowners may be responsible for any injury or groundwater contamination caused by an abandoned well that was not properly decommissioned
THIS IS FROM WASHINGTON STATE ECOLOGY DEPT
Once again, a cover up from our board. Money over safety....how much is in reserves again???
Back to the agenda...
If this is a member meeting, who runs it?
I for one will not approve agenda, we need to move up a few things and know what special rules are. If members have not been made aware prior to meeting, move to have this item taken off. I'm tired of your lying cheating stinking asses.
Members conduct and run this, Gary bye bye
Seems like we might have a big problem if the following is true. If it's not true, "our water folks" should probably make an official statement to clear this up.
According to July 3, 2021 at 4:50 PM "The property of the chipper site is an abandoned well site and cannot be sold unless the well is decommissioned. According to our water folks that is a huge expensive undertaking."
According to July 4, 2021 at 6:33 PM "If you find an abandoned well on your property, you ARE REQUIRED to work with a licensed well driller to properly close it up, a process called decommissioning."
@9:11, Google Washington state department of ecology abandoned wells. Yes, it is required to decommission it. A few phone calls need to be made next week to find out if there is a well on this site. They will have record of it.
You truly want to believe what any board member tells you? It will be another cover up. Just more fodder for an attorney to kick this HOA ass.
We need to get rid of the chipper site. It’s a fire hazard at the very least and no one wants to listen to them grind it up. Better yet, get rid of the stupid tree committee and we wouldn’t need it at all.
I agree. No more dumping as of TODAY and at this point, rather than pay to grind it up, just pay to haul away. And yes, stop with the tree destruction until we can come up with a better plan.
11:54 and 12:19, totally agree with you both. Let's utilize that piece of property for all! I loved others ideas of a park setting, or pickle ball court or even do badminton. Simething for all to use
I’m just gonna say, Surfside HOA owns 52 to 54 lots. There are 2 to 4 across 315 North of the office on the canal. No abandoned well to deal with! Why not look at other lots for this project? Why not sell off some lots while the market is good to finance the project? Why do we own that many lots?
Actually, the lots across the street from the main office is an earlier well field.
Oh, so those need decommissioned too? Wow, how we do things illegal around here. Get rid of all of them
So why as an HOA do we own so many lots? If there’s a well, decommission them and sell the lot! I understand owning the property around the office, water field off J Place, but why prime lots on G to store gravel. How many prime lots is the HOA sitting on?
100 % in your thoughts Doug. We could easily pay for a facility for all of us with just selling a few. But that's logical thinking and some on the board and in the office just simply cannot do that.
Important notice !! Please read Surfside covenant 9, and in particular 9.3. It clearly states that all members are to be notified BY MAIL, no less than 30 days prior to a covenant change hearing.
It is important to note that the Surfside HOA has been very secretive about the Lighting covenant change, and has NOT sent copies of the change by mail to all members 30 days in advance as our covenants specify. Putting it on the Weekender does not suffice. Only about 300 subscribers receive it. Having it hidden on the website, does not qualify as notifying the membership.
The Hearing needs to be canceled, and should it proceed, be challenged in Court. There is a right way and a wrong way to do everything. We have documents with the intention of setting a standard for all parties to follow. This is typical slight of hand Bullsh*t. We've seen it before by Gary Williams. They should all understand that this is in violation of the covenants to proceed.
Thank you Steve! Again the current BOT being sneaky and trying to push it under the rug hoping nobody notices.
This is the kind of garbage that Williams is becoming infamous for.
I truly dislike having to be a member of an organization that will not operate ethically or morally.
Hello, So Ronda lives in Tacoma and is a weekender to surfside- that's not what is needed here at all! She has no real ties she grew up in Pierce county and wants to come on the weekends and tell everyone else how to live! I'm not voting for that!
Just my opinion that board members should at least spend majority of their time on the Penninsula! Living in Tacoma and working there-smh! We appreciate you Ronda, but until you are here full time please dont run for anything!�� when you retire from Dr. Ju and are here as my neighbor that would be great, nice conversation we had, but now is not the time!✌
So someone told me you live in Tacoma and work for a Dentist? If true you really are what we refer to as a tourist- maybe when you live in Pacific county full time - until then I really cant get behind much of what you say....coming to "relax' is one thing, but you wint be available to us when you are cleaning teeth in Tacoma.
If you dont like the way things are run- get up and participate with actions, words only go so far! Glad I dont live here fulltime... you all act and sound ridiculous! I wont even attend meetings as you (most of whom) didnt even grow up here.stay classy and I'm gonna just sit back drink a beer and watch you behave like spoiled brats!
I find this amusing that you all hide behind anonymous- why not use your identity? I was just chatting with Doug about this very thing- anonymous should not be allowed on this blog.
I agree Steve! More true words never spoken! What about those of us that live elsewhere and only come down on the weekends? We should get 60 days- not living here full time it's harder to get caught up. I myself would certainly appreciate more time!
Always easier to complain then try to be part of the solution! I personally feel sorry for the board members- I'm sure it's not easy....but, after today we will have new board members and a fresh start! Hope you newly elected are ready to fix the problems! I mean you all have all the answers!! Steve cox we are counting on YOU!
Doug Malley I believe there is already a plan to do that- I believe Ronda was going to? I cant recall right now, but definately someone should!
So 10 people show up and if those 10 people want to get rid of current members they just need the majority? Guess I better fire up old red and head on up- I would think we need all HOA members for this! I'm going to heed the attorneys advice! You sure have a lot to say for a weekender Ronda- kinda gets old. See you at the meeting!
Just seeing this- I had covid and wasnt keeping up with the blog! What is this BOT you speak of? Guess we can catch up at the meeting-
Why are we going to court?
Why would you say that? Why at least cant you use your name? Pretty childish if you ask me! We are supposed to be a community not hating on one another! Cant wait for new board members I sure hope they put their money where their mouth has been! Interesting times- cant understand how we can all live and call ourselves neighbors- but come on here anon. And say such hateful things! Time to move! Been here most my life and I'm beyond fed up with this nonsense..all the weekenders coming and ruining things!!!
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