Tracy Lofstrom, Surfside Business Manager, Talks...
A "Talk" is usually a two way conversation, NOT one way as with most information from this association or hired staff. The members are not given the opportunity to ask questions in public, especially with what limited information provided. This blog does offer the opportunity to talk back. The following appeared in the current "Weakender"
Let us talk about amenities (utilities) here at SHOA
SHOA provides water to the members. It is clean, safe and for the most part very reliable. Yes, there are line breaks. However, that is being fixed by replacing the older lines. Our crew led by Gil Gonzalez is working very hard on this replacement. I hope the members understand how much money is being saved by having this done in house. I am glad to say, the SHOA Water Department crew is doing a great job!
SHOA also has a place where the normal household garbage (not T.V.’s, BBQ’s, etc.) can be taken and disposed of at a huge savings to the members.
Monthly Costs (this is my actual costs per month)
Long Beach Water $62
Sewer $60
Garbage $28
Total $150 $150 X 12 months = $1800
SHOA members pay $633/year for dues and assessments. $100 is the membership fee and $533 goes towards the rest of the amenities associated here with the HOA. I know members do not pay sewer, but there are repairs and maintenance associated with having a septic system. With regular mainte-nance a septic system lasts a very long time. Locally, pumping out a tank can cost up to $500. I believe every three to five years is suggested if there are good septic practices. $500 divided into 3 years equals $167 per year. So, add that to your dues and assessments for a total of $800 for water, sewer, and garbage. This is still very reasonable and worth the money.
I might add, some of the other amenities here in Surfside include water recreation on the lakes and canals, fishing, cabanas, inexpensive RV storage, access to beach paths, a place to attend/hold classes/meetings (pre-Covid), Sheriff patrol, lovely critters and birds, and friendly, knowledgeable staff.
Sincerely,
Tracy Lofstrom
SHOA Business Manager
35 comments:
Probably for a new post as it pertains to Tracy Lofstrom's article of benefits with our membership.
Her numbers basically re-iterate that full time members are subsidized by part time members. She also did not state her household size, property size, gardens, etc, though a search on the Pacific County Assessor does show ownership of a residential lot in Seaview. Maybe she could do a more in-depth study of actual numbers and correspond them appropriately.
The cost of water would be a lot less for someone using only on a partial basis. In the city my fulltime home is in, the water and sewer bill for my wife and I is approximately $35 a month (billed bi-monthly).
I pay $22 a month for bi-weekly garbage/recycle pick up; and $2 a month for a yard debris can with a $5 charge when I need it picked up, which due to proper composting is only a few times a year.
Yes, she does cover the difference with a septic system, but anyone buying open property here will almost certainly need to install a new septic system as a lot of vacant land has none or it is outdated or collapsed as mine was, so she should have integrated that cost in.
Tracy goes into the further amenities available, so since she is comparing surfside to her own property, she is having us assume she in in an HOA. Meaning she has restrictions on what she can have on her property, her lighting is controlled, and she has to go through an architectural committee for any upgrades. I assume not as I am not aware of any HOAs in Seaview. I have put a tiny home, 120 sf, a fence, and I can do any remodel to the exterior of my home without requiring a review by a governing committee. I can have my exterior lights as bright as I like, on 24/7 if I like; and I can park my trailer in my driveway 365 days a year without being in any violation.
So Tracy, please next time, do a full evaluation, not what you feel we should be thinking about it.
We members have invested millions of dollars over the past fifty plus years in our HOA. As a nonprofit, our costs should be less than other areas. The wasteful lie of replacing "old" pipe continues when the real problem is the water inside the pipe. Doing things on the cheap, ends up costing more in the long run. Tracy as Business Manager, should do her job for which she was hired. Manage the business. She can start by reducing in half, the bloated office staff. We do not need or want her telling us how good we have it. The members will make that judgement.
11:40 is correct, this article basically re-iterates that full time members are subsidized by part time members. The article left out one of the most important statistics in evaluating the benefits. How many homes are used full time? How many homes and RV lots are used part time and for how many days per year? How many lots are not used at all?
As I mentioned before when Reimer and Tracy were hired, they both have alot of skeletons in their closets. Just do a little research. Looks as though the BOT found another Jen Psaki to operate the smoke and mirrors for them.
To those who continue to make statements about full time members being subsidized by part timers a question. Do you have children? I don't. So that means I "subsidized" your little darlings education with my taxes. The big difference between us is I have no choice whereas you had a choice of not buying property here.
Also, when you come to visit do you go out to eat or shop at Jack's and Okie's? Even before covid who helps keep them in business during the off season. It's the full timers who shop there regularly not those of you that come down here occasionally.
And I subsidize your Social Security by continuing to work.
No one subsidizes anyone in this HOA. All utilities, no matter where you live, charge a minimum rate. If you own here, you pay the minimum rate just like everyone else and everyone is entitled to use the minimum amount of 5000 cubic feet. If you don't use it, no one cares, if you use more than the minimum, you pay for overage.
Your argument "doesn't hold water" (pun intended)
I find it amazing that the HOA doesn't know or care how many members are full time residents, how many residences are considered "view properties" (and according to what criteria ?), how many full time owners live on the ridge, how many on the eastside, elsewhere in the community ? How many RV sites have elec., water, septic ? How many camping sites are used annually ?
The HOA and board are responsible for serving ALL of the members, and gearing community services and covenants to best serve everyone fairly. My best estmste is that there are about 200 ridgetop households, with about 150 full time. I estimate that there are about another 300 to 350 full time residents elsewhere....so about 500 full time households in Surfside. So only about 25% of Surfside households are full time by my estimate, and over 1500 part time member households.
I'm just guessing, but I challenge anyone to provide proof otherwise. There is no doubt that the financial might of 2050 member households is what gives the BOT its' swagger, and the audacity to demand owners top their trees until they are dead, limit their lighting choices to the stupid impractical ones they want to mandate.... and 1500 of the memberships paying 3 times as much in dues, definitely helps pay for the services full time owners utilize the most.
I’ve been wondering what sort of impact all these new members ie: lots of new homes being built and homes being sold to people moving here. There will be no more revenue generated from this new influx of people. The county will benefit from new tax revenues, but here we’ve all been paying the same dues and assessments every year with the majority of said properties not having full time residents! Now there will be more using the compactor, more water being used ect. I hope it doesn’t make an negative impact, but who knows?
Our dues and assessments should be based on property values, the same as the county. This would be more fair for the members.
@12:23, your comment is the only one who hit it on the head. The business staff needs reduced! This is a community of 3000 and we continue to hire more and more who obviously do less and less
This conversation is becoming silly. No one anywhere pays utility rates based on property values. Water is a utility and the HOA is "supposed" to be non profit. Consider this when you pay the bill. If a person has 3 lots, they pay 3 times. If they don't want to pay 3 times, they can sell the vacant lot(s). Let someone else pay for that lot. It's simple really. There's no need to try and be "better" than anyone else with the idea of subsidizing, which is NOT the situation here. Rates will only go up when the cost to purchase or produce the product needed becomes more.
I hope we can all agree that public education benefits our society regardless of whether or not one has children. This discussion is about the cost/benefit of amenities.
It's the same in most cities/towns. Example: If the sewer line is being installed in front of your house and you don't want to hook up, you will still have to pay for it even if you don't want it, use it, or need it.
There's so many hidden rules, regulations, laws, in any place a person lives.
Another example: Last place I lived, we the people, would vote to NOT annex into the city limits. Some government official (probably a developers brother) found a way of requiring every building permit to agree to join into the "city limits" when the time came. When those lots were built up and sold (because developers came and gobbled up the land) the new outnumbered the old, guess what happened? That's right, we were annexed into the city. All it did was cost us more in Utilities because we now got to pay city taxes on those services when before, we were county and didn't pay the taxes but they had to provide the service.
Someone is always looking for ways to part us from our money and many are sneaky attorneys.
No one is subsidizing anyone, but if you want to, I would greatly appreciate it if you would start with me :).
We have been RVers in Surfside for over 20 years. We don't think of the dues and assessments as subsidizing the full timers. We consider our property a really great bargain. We bought our lot because we got tired of not being able to find a campsite at the last minute. We got tired of the barking dogs, loud parties, being 5 feet away from the next camp site, a steady stream of people coming in all night long and on and on. So here we are in our little slice of heaven by the beach. Here's how we calculate the cost. In the days we were working and only came on long weekends we used our property about 30 days a year. Even at the current cost of $633 per year that is $21 a night. Now that we're retired, we use our lot 60-120 days per year, depending on health and of course last year covid. That's $5 to $10 per night. Where can you find a really nice campsite for that price with lovely neighbors who watch out for your property when you're not there? Of course the one caveat is the up front expense of septic system, water and electric hook up, some gravel. But even with that it's still a bargain. And we don't have to haul our garbage home. It sounds like there might be some inconsiderate RVers in our midst that give all RVers a bad reputation. Please don't judge all RVers based on the behavior of a few.
That's not to say we shouldn't be looking for ways to cut the budget. We should always try to be more efficient and cut down on unnecessary expenses.
Benefits of membership, eh?
Current benefits include no security, bad water, and a full compactor.
Benefits also include ruthlees tree enforcement, even where not needed, as well as the lighting issue. Doe anybody but J Placers benefit? As usual, no.
Mix in a self-serving Board, you don't even follow their own rules, and you have the perfect mix, apparently. Dysfunctional all the way.
9:10 illustrates why we can't fix this place. The rv people only care about a cheap place to park and camp. If they lived here full time, they might care, pay attention to the issues, and vote. More and more we are becoming nothing more than an rv park. They should be required to pay double dues and assessments. Their cost should be the same as staying in an rv park.
Why does this always turn into an us against them fight. RVers do care, we do pay full attention and we do vote. And we pay the same dues and assessments as everyone else. Seems folks like to use the "you knew what the covenants were when you bought here argument" a lot. Well, the same can be said about RVs. You knew about the covenants that allow RVs. You could see all the RV lots. If you didn't want RVers then you should have bought in a development that doesn't allow them. The "if you don't like it move" argument, that is voiced so often, holds true in this case as well.
12:07....I hear you,and think it's too bad. I do think that the animosity of a few commentors on the blog is not shared by a significant number of members.
While I think it's just a fact that all part timer's dues help pay for our community services while using them less than the full timers, there's no real concern about it.
What is discouraging is the nasty little hateful comments from the ungrateful turds who refuse to acknowledge it. Many full timers participate in the HOA for the benefit of all. Most on the BOT are prone to be self-serving, fortunately Not all.
Us vs. Them
This is a product of poor community planning. Purchasing a home is a huge expense and commitment. No one advises the home purchaser about the rights of camping lots. Imagine purchasing your home in November only to be over run with RV's in March. Imagine having to suffer the 24 hour campfire smoke, having to keep your windows closed and not being able to even walk down the street without a barrage of weekenders and you are expected to just suck it up because it's "their property" and they can do what they want. Rv'ers have somewhere else to go, your RV can leave, you have another home. Full time home owners here do not. They are stuck and have to tolerate it.
And then there's the RV'ers. You want to camp, have fun, build community and make plans. Enjoy the beach and just relax. This should be your time to do just that but understand, you are in a neighborhood. Would you like this in the neighborhood where you live full time?
Who is at fault? Not the full timer, homeowner, or RV'er. It is simply poor disastrous community planning.
Impossible to fix now, but understanding each other with compassion and humanity would be a start.
I have never seen so much burning in my life until I moved here. Why don't people know about the restrictions on burning? They know about every other restriction but not this one? Crazy and inconsiderate to everyone around. And why doesn't the HOA take care of this? This would eliminate a lot of discomfort with the smoke people complain about. It only costs $20 to haul this waste to the dump. Lazy and rude to burn this debris.
2.5 Outdoor burning of land clearing debris or construction debris is prohibited.
Small (3 foot x 3 foot) campfires, cooking fires, and natural yard debris
fires are permitted provided they meet the criteria for such uses adopted
by the Pacific County Fire District #1, and meet the requirements of
Section 5.8
Understanding each other with compassion and humanity would be a start. Could not agree more. We have a very mixed area (homes and RVers). We all get along extremely well and go out of our way to help each out. We receive a very warm welcome from our homeowner (full time) neighbors when we arrive. Last year, they were worried about us because we came later in the year due to covid. Should have thought to call and let them know we were OK but just following the guidelines about staying put. Peace.
@March 13, 2021 at 4:59 PM
I wish you were our RV neighbor because what we have is very inconsiderate. Fire 24/7 even while they are inside for the night. And the others create so much smoke because they are too cheap to haul away their tree debris. It's spiteful and mean and no one is going to look out for them at all. They are on their own now because of the disrespect. And Yes, they have been asked, all of them, to tone down the fires and smoke, they just don't give a damn and neither does the HOA. Wouldn't it be nice if the HOA gave them advice on how to dispose of tree debris and tell them not to burn it in the campfire when they mail their letters to cut the trees? Gee what a concept. My wish - if they are going to demand tree cleaning, the HOA should provide brush pick up for people so the other residents don't have to suffer with carcinogens blowing around the neighborhoods. It's really creating a bad environment.
Sorry to hear about your inconsiderate RV neighbors. No wonder some folks dread March 15th. We consider ourselves very fortunate. Absolutely no need to burn brush anymore. We have the chipper site. You're right....HOA needs to give instructions on how to properly dispose of brush.
The chipper site is only open for a short time during the Summer. The best time to prune trees is in the Winter. The best most effective way to control tree disease and insects is to burn. Deposited at a chipper site and encourage members to spread the disease is wrong. Experts claim, including the County, recommend burning Gorse for best control of spreading the seed. The chipping encourages tree topping, which is in violation of the Fire Wise program. They clearly state..."Do Not Top Trees". Members should not have to pay for other members to maintain their lot's. According to the Pacific County Health Ordinance, it is illegal to operate a "dumping site" without proper permits and approval.
Everyone in HOA knows for the last 20 years or more there has been no tree enforcement by SHOA. Now out of blue WITH NO FOR WARNING 2020 till 2022 we I’ll force everyone to comply and even though all of surfside is at fault just those of you will pay the price sorry not sorry is this fair? Not in any way
But if this was not resort place these businesses that are here wouldn’t have flourished as much argument goes both ways and some would never be available
Best time to prune is when? Opinion yours entirely if I want a differing opinion I can counter yours in a second but let’s go with yours than why the hell isn’t the chipper open when most of members will need it? When they receive nasty cut your tree this year notices. Where has SHOA been all those years that a lot of trees have grown twice ‘acceptable’ height? Who made current BOT kings of our world where have they been last decades
I highly suggest Tracy and all try let’s listen instead of talking. Any idea I have proposed in the last year the only responses from BOT is to think nope we do not want to even consider your idea and we don’t think we will but I can bet I can think of all the reasons I shouldn’t have to
I have seen some towns (not in Washington) who include brush pick up in their garbage service fees. One place had quarterly brush pick up. The residents could trim trees and clean up other debris. Pile it on the street and the city would come through with the chipper truck. Nice concept, stops burning, not everyone has a truck to haul stuff away.
My Brush pick is an as needed and I pre-book and pay as I need the service. Though I assume any pick up will never be an option with this HOA.
Sorry 11:10 you are wrong. What 9:10 illustrates is someone who likes and appreciates living here, apparently something you don't.
I would also be curious to know where you live to give the opinion we're becoming a rv park. In my neighborhood and the drive to it all I've seen has been lots getting houses built on them. Houses where if they weren't built for the lot owner to live sell quickly. You also forgot that there have been many RV'ers that bought here who end up building because the find out they love it. Who knows, maybe 9:10 will end up doing so. If they did become full timers I'm willing to lay odds they won't have your nasty attitude.
The new business manager is apparently unaware that about 3/4 of the membership are part time residents, and have homes elsewhere.
We are well aware that our Surfside dues and assessments are very reasonable. That doesn't excuse the amount of community funds that are wasted on legal fees, fines, studies, and foolish projects.
We are not working on the budget-but the Board IS trying to push the community into accepting a very poorly conceived covenant rewrite.
So it's not wise as an owner in Surfside to just accept what we are allowed by the HOA. The Tree policy has been allowed to victimize members for over 50 years. Take a good look at how that has worked out.
I agree with Cox. Board to focus on cutting the budget or at the very least keeping it in check. As he said we waste so much on legal fees, fines, studies, and foolish projects. Cut the budget not add expenses like that water wagon.
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